Date: 02/08/2025 02/09/2025
Location: Star River Meditation Center
Teacher: Yunquan Huang
Dharma Talk
The Layman Jetavana Does Not Necessarily Believe What the Buddha Says
Once, the Jain leader Nigantha Nataputta, along with his group of ascetics, came to the region of Mount Macchikasanda to spread their teachings. Nigantha learned that the layman Jetavana was an influential and wealthy figure in the area and decided to recruit him as a disciple.Jetavana, knowing Nigantha’s intentions, took the initiative to visit him.
After greeting each other, Nigantha asked Jetavana:
“Layman! Regarding what the ascetic Gautama says: ‘There is a meditative state without applied thought and sustained thought, and there is the cessation of applied and sustained thought,’ do you believe it?”
“Venerable Sir, when it comes to this matter, I do not need to believe what the Blessed One says.”
Nigantha, aware that Jetavana was a lay disciple of the Buddha, assumed that Jetavana no longer had faith in the Buddha. He thought this was an excellent opportunity to win over this influential layman. Feeling quite pleased, Nigantha turned to his disciples and said, in an admiring tone and with a proud demeanor:
“Look! This layman Jetavana is so upright! So honest! So open-minded and free from rigidity!
Layman, some people think that by ceasing applied and sustained thought, they can catch the wind with a net or stop the flow of the Ganges with their fist. But as for me, I maintain a vision of wisdom in all my actions—walking, standing, sitting, and lying down.”
“Venerable Sir, do you think ‘faith’ should come first, or ‘wisdom’? Between ‘faith’ and ‘wisdom,’ which is superior?” Jetavana began to question Nigantha in return.
“Layman, faith should come first, and then wisdom arises. But if we compare the two, wisdom is superior.”
“Venerable Sir, I say this: Whenever I wish, I can detach myself from sensory pleasures and all unwholesome states, entering the first jhāna with applied and sustained thought, experiencing rapture and joy born of detachment, and abide there.
Further, I can calm applied and sustained thought, and with the mind becoming tranquil and concentrated, experience rapture and joy born of concentration, entering the second jhāna and abiding there without applied or sustained thought.
Moreover, I can cease rapture, entering and abiding in the third jhāna, experiencing equanimity and mindfulness.
Finally, I can go beyond pleasure and pain, entering and abiding in the fourth jhāna, characterized by purity of mindfulness and equanimity.
Venerable Sir, with such abilities, why would I need to ‘believe’ any ascetic or Brahmin who speaks of ‘meditation without applied and sustained thought’ or ‘the cessation of applied and sustained thought’?”
Jetavana then clarified his true meaning.
At this point, Nigantha realized he had misunderstood Jetavana’s words and felt tricked. Angrily, he exclaimed:
“Look at this layman Jetavana! How deceitful! How dishonest! How hypocritical he is!”
“Venerable Sir, did you not just praise me for being upright and honest? How is it that, in just a moment, you have reversed your opinion and now call me deceitful and dishonest? If what you said earlier was correct, then what you say now must be wrong, and vice versa. You also claimed to maintain a vision of wisdom in all your actions—walking, standing, sitting, and lying down. Yet you cannot even discern this small matter. How, then, can you expect to understand or accomplish things that are beyond the ordinary?”
“Venerable Sir, if I ask you a question, do you have the ability to provide a clear and definitive explanation? Not just one question—if I were to ask you ten questions, could you provide a clear and definitive answer to each? If not, how can you expect to persuade me to become your disciple?”
Hearing this, Nigantha was left speechless. Embarrassed, he quickly packed his belongings and left with his followers.
